141: How YouTube Still Brings in Clients Years Later (With Mallory Grimste)

In this episode, Jules White welcomes her friend Mallory Grimste, a licensed clinical social worker based in Connecticut and New York, to talk about how she's used YouTube to grow her therapy practice without relying on social media.

Mallory shares how she started making videos back in 2015/2016 after being encouraged to get on camera, and how joining a YouTube-focused programme helped her take it seriously from 2018 onwards. She explains why she stopped producing new long-form videos back in 2022, yet her back catalogue of over 400 videos and 7,000+ subscribers continues to bring in clients today, split almost evenly between Google search and YouTube.

Key Takeaways:

• Building an Evergreen Video Library: Mallory explains why she no longer needs to post weekly, and how her older videos (including the ones she now finds "cringe") continue to work for her years later.
• Repurposing Content: Discover how Mallory turns her videos into blog posts, email content, and even podcast episodes, all from a single piece of core content.
• Metrics That Actually Matter: Mallory breaks down why average watch time and click-through rate matter more than subscriber counts, and shares realistic benchmarks to aim for.
• Avoiding Common YouTube Mistakes: Learn why chasing trends and copying other people's content style rarely pays off, and why authenticity outperforms polish.
• The YouTube Health Shelf: Mallory explains this lesser-known feature that helps verified licensed professionals stand out from AI-generated or unqualified content.

If you're wondering whether YouTube could work for your business without needing to be glued to social media, this episode is well worth a listen.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

• Episode 058: Jules and Mallory's Google Business Profile audit episode
• Mallory's website
• Mallory's YouTube channel
• Breaking Up with Insurance Guide – Mallory's programme for therapists moving away from insurance panels
• Stop the Referral Panic – Mallory's programme helping therapists manage client flow
• Your Calm Code – Mallory's coping skills programme for teens and young adults

Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast for more ways to grow your business without relying on social media!

Transcript

Introduction & Guest Welcome

Jules White: Hi. Welcome back to the Website Success Show.

It is Jules here and today I'm really excited to welcome a very special guest. My lovely friend Mallory is here to talk to us about how she has used YouTube to grow her business.

As part of this series we've been doing on the different ways that we can grow our business without social media. I had a chat with Mallory and just knew I wanted to get her in so we could have a little chat on the podcast about how she's used it.

So welcome Mallory. It's so great to have you here.

Mallory Grimste: Hi.

Thank you. It's awesome to be here as well.

And, um, the feeling's mutual, love everything that you're doing. I constantly am referring people to you and your services, so thank you.

I hope they're taking action on that.

Jules White: Yeah, yeah, definitely. That has definitely happened where people have come into my world and it's been from you, so thank you very much.

And we obviously we've done collaborations as well, so you have been a guest on the podcast before. Back in episode 58 we did a, um, an audit episode of Mallory's Google Business Profile.

So that was good fun. And also we've done a collaboration where I've, I've been in your programme and teaching people about how they can grow their business without social media.

So I, I am like, I just love the power of collaborations. We met, I think through an online programme.

I think that was where we, where, where our paths first crossed. But then I see I, it is so funny.

I see people in different places and you, it it just, you realise how small the world is really, even though we're international. It's um, it's so nice when you see people in different places online.

Really?

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, I totally agree. I feel like I like see people and I'm like, I know we know each other, but like which pocket?

Jules White: I end up bumping into people locally as well, and I'm like, have I met you online? And it's, it is, yeah.

It's so funny. It is.

Yeah. It's a bit like the beauty world.

It was always, it was always very small and you end up seeing the same people. So, and probably the same in the world of therapy as well.

I would imagine so.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. Yeah.

But I think it says a lot about like the connections that you make that if like your name keeps popping up in different circles, even if you are not actually in that circle, that just goes to show you like the power of, you know, word of mouth, networking, connecting. And it doesn't all have to be like having a fancy Instagram or whatever the hot social media is of the moment.

Jules White: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

It doesn't have to be posting every day. And I, I love the fact of building relationships because no algorithm can take that away.

Whatever happens, those people that you've got to know and you've build that, build that trust with, I think just, um, is always there, really. So yeah.

I love it. Love it, love it.

So Mallory, let's dive in and have a chat about YouTube and how amazing it's been for your business and also what, what, you know, I've got a few questions about what, why you started using YouTube and what, and what, what it means for your business right now, I think as well, really. But first, before we dive into that, I would love you to introduce yourself and let us all know what you do and what your business is all about.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, absolutely.

About Mallory's Practice & Services

Mallory Grimste: So my name is Mallory Grimste. I am a licensed clinical social worker in the states of Connecticut and New York.

Um, in the US right now, it's um, your licence is by state. So like you can't necessarily cross-practise unless you have, um, reciprocity is what it's called.

Uh, they're working on changing it, but it's not quite there yet. Uh, but I work primarily with tweens, teens and young adults that are going through, um, different transitional phases.

Usually anxiety and depression, identity concerns are kind of in there. Um, but I really, really love helping kids that are struggling with things like self-harm or suicidal thinking because it is so powerful and so cool to see them like realise that they have the strategies and that there is hope that this doesn't last forever.

Things do get better and I have enough years of experience now that I have enough success stories that I can be like, yes, there is another

Jules White: story. You're not alone in this.

Other people have been through this as well. Yeah,

Mallory Grimste: yeah.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Fantastic. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Jules White: So, um, let us know about the structure of your business as well. So how you, how people can buy from you, how you work with your clients.

And I think you've got, I think since we last actually spoke, you've got some new things that you are offering. You may be working with therapists as well, so

Mallory Grimste: Yes.

Yeah, so my primary like thing always has and probably always will be my counselling clients, like love them. Um, but I also, because I've been in this world for so long, I've had so many therapists reach out to me, like, how do you do that?

How do you do that? And I'm a, you know, I'm very generous.

I'm a giver, so I will tell you, but I was like, I'm literally saying the same things over and over again. Let me just kinda like throw it in like something so people can just, here it is.

So I do have, um, two programmes for therapists. One is called the Breaking Up with Insurance Guide, which is how I was able to work through, you know, my own like struggles with the idea of like not accepting health insurance in order to make my private practise work and, um, how to go about that ethically and sustainably.

I've been, um, totally off of insurance panels for my practise since 2016. So we've just hit 10 years officially this year.

Um, and my other programme that I recently started is called Stop the Referral Panic because I was consistently seeing in all these like therapist groups and talking to other therapists that everybody was really struggling with the idea of like, how do I like, keep the referrals coming in? How do I make sure they're like a good fit and like feeling kind of like that frenzy and panic to the point that people were thinking about closing down their practises.

And I was like, well, don't do that.

Jules White: There are, there are options.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, and I think it was just kind of the, um, you know, during the pandemic it was like, it's particularly the shutdown portion, it was very easy to make the time for therapy because everybody was kind of struggling and like, what is this world that we're living in?

And it was like an easy thing to like hop on, log on.

But as you know, things have kind of like regulated and I wouldn't say go back to normal 'cause like what is normal, but I think that, um, therapists who probably started a practise like during that frenzy aren't used to like the natural ebbs and flows and like how to, like, notice that, make that work. And so, um, Jules asked for your, um, thank you so much for doing that guest lesson, by the way, on how SEO or, I mean, not SEO.

Wow. Social media is optional.

Um, because I think a lot of people see like the buildup and they're like, oh, I need to like be dancing on camera. And that's a strategy that's totally an approach and you can do that.

But, um, that's usually like if you're looking for a therapist, you're not making sure they're a good dancer on

Jules White: Yes. 10 times a day.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, yeah. Like, I don't know.

You bet you I don't have time for that.

Jules White: And nobody wants no time energy. No, no, I think that's a really good point.

I think especially for businesses like yours where you help people get better. So I always, I definitely think this is something that I've realised over the last probably 18 months or so of working out who SEO is a good, a good fit for is the people that need constant clients.

They need a steady stream of clients coming into their business. And for therapy, you do help people get better.

I've been working with a lot of physios and osteopaths at the moment, and they're another business where you help people get better. So unfortunately you need people coming through all the time or fortunately, you know, depending on which way you look at it.

Whereas like hairdressers, if they're, if you're a good hairdresser, generally you don't need that many new people coming in to fill your books. But yeah, it's, it, I think it is definitely something where that, that panic can set in and you kind of think, oh, social media, that must be the option to, to fill my books, really.

Whereas actually there are a lot easier ways, and I'm not necessarily saying what we're talking about today is easy and we'll definitely talk about that. But how did you kind of make that decision that YouTube was gonna be a good strategy and when did, well actually tell us about when you started with YouTube as well.

Really?

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. So I,

How Mallory Started on YouTube

Mallory Grimste: so my practise officially opened in 2014 and I had no idea what I was doing. It was just, um, like, well, I knew what I was doing from a therapy standpoint, but not from a business standpoint.

Yeah,

Jules White: yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Um, it was a situation where I had a, um, a friend who was also, um, working her way towards licensure and her husband, um, was like, Hey, have office space.

If you wanna use it, you can sublet for me. Um, I'll give you like three months free to see if you like it.

And I was like, well, it's free. Okay. And I did.

Um, but because of that, I joined a programme called Business School Bootcamp for therapists, where it was run by two therapists who really taught you the backend of the business side of things, including marketing structure and things like that. And, um, they only held this conference once, and I'm so glad that I went.

They had an in-person conference called The Most Awesome Conference for Therapists. So I just love the name.

And so I flew out to California, I met with them. I met a whole bunch of other like really amazing therapists.

And in, um, one of my one-to-ones with one of the coaches, uh, her name is Miranda Palmer. She was like, you really need to be on video, like your whole personality and everything.

Like people need to see it, they need to feel it. And I was like, not me.

Jules White: Oh.

Mallory Grimste: But that really, really sat with me. And so I was like, okay, I'm gonna like kind of give it a go.

Um, and so shortly after that, um, I can't remember if it was the tail end of 2015 or maybe 2016, I did start like showing up on video. And um, if you look at some of my really old videos, they are very cringe.

The tech, I mean, I am like, like I'm very pale to begin with, but I look like, I don't know what colour white.

Jules White: I can definitely relate to that, Mallory. I have that issue as well myself.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah,

Jules White: yeah,

Mallory Grimste: yeah. But, um, I did have a lot of clients that were, were telling me and, and families that like, oh, I saw your video, which still feels a little like, oh, you saw it even though that's the point.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Um, but I started really, really taking it seriously probably like the end of 2018, early 2019. Um, I joined a programme, uh, with Trina Little at the time, I think it was called YouTube for creatives.

I think it's like shifted and changed since then. 'cause she, what I really liked about her is she has her MBA, so she fully understands like the business side of things and she caters to using YouTube when you have a business, not because like you're trying to be an influencer or any of that.

Like that happens great, but like that's not the point. And how like using that is a little bit different.

And so, um, with a lot of her encouragement in the community there, um, I like was churning out weekly videos for a while. Um, I do think the lockdown portion of the pandemic helped with that.

Mm-hmm. Uh, but even since then, I think the last time I did like a full, like true long-form video, like that was probably February of 2022.

And people still find and use those resources. Like I have a hard time keeping up with the comments, which I never thought I would have that problem.

Jules White: Fantastic.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. So it's still working.

Even like I have not consistently showed up with new videos in over four years.

Jules White: Wow. That's amazing.

I was looking at your figures this morning and I saw you, you've got over 400 videos and I think is it over 7,000 subscribers? And I know when we were working through the programme that we were in together, you hit a milestone, I think on the number of views that you had.

Was it a hundred thousand views or was it a, I I can't remember what. There

Mallory Grimste: was one. Oh, you know what?

I would have to like look it up because like, honestly, I don't even like pay attention to that anymore. Like, it's cool, but, um, like I can't reasonably see 7,000 people in my office, but it's really cool that I've been able to have information and help out there that at least 7,000 individuals have like, clicked, like Yes, subscribe.

And even more than that have seen and hopefully implemented some of the strategies. Yeah.

Like that's, those are really the numbers that I want. Not necessarily like how many likes and views am I having.

Like it is cool to see it, but like, I don't know, numbers kind of like go in and outta my head.

Jules White: Yeah, I think that's a really good way to approach it actually. 'cause a lot of these things can be vanity metrics.

So I think definitely, although I did see something recently about, um, oh, I think it was about the number of subscribers actually, but there's a, there's a new Google. Thing coming out.

It was a few weeks ago, I read about it and it was that you could create, you could have a Google, I can't even remember what they called it. This, this is not the, not the best thing for actually describing this, but it was basically for, if you've got over a hundred thousand subscribers on YouTube or a hundred thousand Instagram followers, you could get, um, like a place with on Google where you can then control what shows about you.

It was, it looked like it was basically almost like a Google business profile for influencers, but you had to have a, you know, this number of followers to be able to do that. So, but I think it was subscribers on YouTube actually, because I was thinking, okay, who do I know that's got that number of, number of followers?

So I messaged Carrie Green, not that I know Carrie, but I'm in, in the Female Entrepreneur Association. I was like, oh, you might wanna check this out.

So,

Mallory Grimste: yeah, yeah. But

Jules White: anyway,

Mallory Grimste: they're always doing things like that, which is like pretty cool. Like one of the things that I really like that YouTube specifically has done, um, since the Pandemic, 'cause there was all sorts of misinformation going out there.

Mm-hmm. And people claiming they were, they had a certain authority that they didn't, um, which is troublesome, which is a big reason why I do show up publicly.

Yeah. To be like, I'm an actual therapist and this is really what we recommend. Yeah.

Um, but they have this thing called YouTube Health Shelf, where if you are a licensed professional, um, you can submit your credential information and they like, make sure it matches up that you are who you say you are. And then on, it's not on all videos, but it's on certain videos with sensitive health information.

It will show up at the bottom. It's like a little blue bar that says that this is from a licensed healthcare professional or mental health professional or whatever your profession is.

And I've seen it on, um, I can't think, I think the channel name. It's like Mr.

And Mrs. Muscles. I like follow along with their workouts.

Sometimes I really like them, but they're like actual licensed personal trainers, like with certification. So like sometimes on the bottom I see.

On theirs. So it's not exclusive to like licensed clinical social workers.

Um, and I've seen it, it's like across the globe in different countries. So, um, amazing.

I love that, that they're differentiating that this is coming from. An actual provider and not someone with a camera.

Jules White: Yeah. Or somebody with AI right now as well, I think.

Correct, definitely. I wanted to talk about the fact of having had so many videos, and I know you said about cringing on your old videos, but I, I was literally just thinking about this before we came on of how important that is, especially now.

And if you are somebody who has built that up pre AI, then I think don't delete. Definitely.

I know you wouldn't, but don't delete the old stuff because it's, it shows that you knew what you were doing and that you are legitimate before AI and you're not just somebody who knows how to use AI. And I think in terms of actually from an SEO point of view in showing up in AI search and getting recommended in AI search, that is what the AI bots are gonna be looking for.

That you are trustworthy and that you are legitimate human who has these lived experiences. So yeah, I think that's so important that those old ones are there for you to cringe at, but for everybody to know that you do know what you're talking about really.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. And honestly, like even on those ones, I still get comments about like how helpful this was or how like inspired them to like try one of the strategies or my favourite is when they like share like their story that they were afraid to talk to their parents and get help and then they did and it was fine.

And I'm like, yes, like more please. Yes.

Um, and that's not to say that's everybody's experience and I wanna be sensitive to that. Um, but I'm glad that there are people who are benefiting, even if like, you know, my ego is like, oh, wear of bronzer.

Jules White: No, it's nice, especially in the work work that you're doing. I think in the work that all of it, all of us are doing, we wanna know that we're helping people.

And actually, yeah, just even if it's just a comment on your video then that it's not just a comment, it's somebody's life that you have helped actually. So I think that's really important.

So why did you decide actually before we dive into that, let's talk first about back in the beginning, how long it took to take to get traction and was there a particular reason that you decided to do YouTube rather than, I don't even know what social media would've been around back then, but rather than social media or maybe you were doing both.

Mallory Grimste: Um, I was doing a little bit of both, but what I was really kind of delving more into was the YouTube videos because it took a lot more, um, effort to like, like plan it out, to film it, to edit it. Like it took a little bit more labour and love.

And so I would like, let me like focus on that. Um, and I was like learning that skill as I was in that programme now.

Oh my gosh. Like the people who are starting now have so many cool, just like, like Descript was not a thing where you could just like click um, yeah.

Jules White: Descript.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. Yeah.

And I do think, um, I wanna be totally transparent that one of the things that I think really helped me be able to keep up on that and my client work was the fact that, um, I had a friend from college who was a media production major, who like graduated, was working in the field and he was like, Hey, I've been seeing your videos. Would you want a video editor?

And I was like, oh, I don't know about that. And then he's like, well, let me just like do a video or two for you and like see how you like it.

And he was phenomenal. And so, um, like you'll see a drastic difference

Jules White: to see when

Mallory Grimste: he starts working. You'll see the, um, the before and after difference for sure.

Um, but he, um, you know, he had a change in his own business structure and everything, and so he was, um, um, discontinuing that service. And so, um, I think that video in February was the last one he did for me.

And I was like, oh yeah, yeah, I'll get back to it. I'll get back to it.

But honestly, I haven't really needed to. Um, and I've been so busy with my counselling clients and with my other ventures, which was the point, and like, how many times can I genuinely share the same like, information, like if it wasn't continuing to pop up in searches and things like that.

Yeah, I would like recreate like a new video, but like at a certain point I'm like, okay, I have like 400 videos. Like it's there.

And I can share it like that. The core information is not shifting or changing.

And so I can, like, if I have a new client who's struggling with, um, separation anxiety, I can, um, like talk with them about it in session. But I can also follow up and be like, Hey, outside of session if you wanna review this, here's something that you can use.

Um, and I, I do tell my clients like, it doesn't have to be my video. Like, that might be weird. Um, but there's so much helpful information out there now.

Jules White: Yeah, definitely. And if people trust you, then why not your videos, but versus somebody could have just generated an AI one, so Definitely.

I think, yeah. So are you, did, do the videos still bring you clients and have they bought you clients over the years?

Is that, that, I guess that was kind of the goal, but did it actually do what you wanted it to to do?

YouTube Results: Clients & Business Impact

Mallory Grimste: Absolutely. Yeah.

Like when I look at my, I did like a whole breakdown of all the clients that I've had since the time I opened my practise until, um, I wanna say it was like spring of last year. And when I broke down, like, um, where people were coming from, um, how they found me and how they started working with me, it was almost exactly like a 50-50 split between, um, like Google and YouTube, like search and word-of-mouth referrals, which was almost always because somebody had sent a video.

Jules White: Yeah. Amazing.

I love that. I absolutely love that.

Obviously I think that's just fantastic. So were you, were you doing other things to market your business as well or were things, had you, did you kind of make that decision of No, that's what I'm focusing on and I'm gonna let the other stuff go, I'm gonna not do the social media too much or at all, or.

Content Strategy: Repurposing & Blogging

Mallory Grimste: So in the very beginning, like when I made the decision to like focus on YouTube, I was pretty much just doing YouTube, turning it into like a really sloppy blog. Like, like sometimes it was just like the video and here's the link.

Um, so I do need to still, I'm still cleaning up as, you know, my backend of like 10 years of lots of blogs. But, um, like eventually I got a little more like finesse with that and like use the transcript and like turn that into a blog post.

So I would like kind of use that as like my core piece of content or like my hub. Um, and then I would email my email list, um, that like, Hey, there's this new video about this.

And like, again, as you know, every skill I feel like is like kinda layer upon itself. Like it kind of builds upon itself.

And eventually, um, I've gotten to the point where I've been able to repurpose, um, or like, um, like multiply that content from that one video. And so now, um, even though I haven't created like a new video, like long-form video like that in years, um, if I have certain content or certain videos that I know cyclically like kind of pop up as like, people are searching for this, they're commenting on it, they're wanting more information on that, I'll use that video to like finesse the blog post.

And then from that blog post I'll create, um, other pieces of content where I'll post on, um, LinkedIn, Facebook, Pinterest is a big one, I will say. Um, and Instagram.

Um, and from all of those, like, I don't necessarily think people are like, like clicking from like my Instagram, but I do think having some findability is helpful, but it's not like, like. Instagram, I, I'm more so used for like, connecting with colleagues, honestly.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Like for my own entertainment.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Um, and like it's there for people to see like, I'm here.

Jules White: Yeah. Yeah.

Absolutely. Yeah.

I think, I think having a presence there and if you've, if you have already got a presence, then it's certainly not, it's good to keep it and not, you know, I wouldn't say if somebody's deciding to completely break up with social media, I wouldn't be deleting your profiles 'cause it's there and it, it just helps to show that you are online. But it's, this is in terms of like, not having to keep posting and not having to use it and not having to log in if you don't want to.

And, and I, it's all, it's all optional. That's the whole point of this series is that social media is optional.

And optional means you can choose to use it for some things if you want to, but you don't have to use that to grow your business. And I tend to say focusing on content that you own first, which obviously we don't own our YouTube channel, but the fact that you are making them into, or you have made them into blogs over the years and, uh, we, we've had multiple conversations about the fact of having so much content there that you don't then necessarily need to be creating new blogs, but updating the old ones, making sure that they're all linked together.

Um, that's, it's definitely a work in, in progress. But I think for all of us, I've been thinking that about my own blogs and things as well.

AND I'm actually currently creating something that will help with that. Help with trying to even understand what content we have out there.

'cause I think that's the thing is we have this websites full of content. We don't necessarily realise how much is there and how much, how many opportunities are there as well.

So yeah, it's definitely that. Um, so if people, so do you, do you think of, of as YouTube as, because I know some people think of YouTube as a form of social media.

Do you think of it that way? Or what are your kind of thoughts on it really?

YouTube as a Search Engine vs Social Media

Mallory Grimste: Um, technically yes and no. Um, because there is a social media aspect to it.

There is, um, and again, they're like always changing, like what unlocks in terms of features. Like some things like, I remember you had to wait till you had a hundred subscribers and then a thousand, like, it's always shifting.

Um, so like, I have no idea what the status part is for this or if it's just like a feature now. But at some point I unlocked like the community posting, which means like, when you're scrolling, like it, it almost is like a feed where you can like, have an image, you can have a poll question, you can have like just a text, um, that you can post.

It doesn't have to be a video that shows up with video, of course. So it's like, like old-school Facebook, I feel like, um.

But like, you don't necessarily have like a social media profile, like your profile is your channel page, which is like your videos and things like that. Um, but I, I do look at it more so as like search engine with a community aspect, because Google owns YouTube now.

Mm-hmm. And they have for several years.

And like, I even notice, like when I check like, okay, am I showing up for like the, the people searches that I want to, like I, my physical office is in Branford, Connecticut, so if somebody is searching, searching for, um, a therapist for my teenager in Bradford, Connecticut, I wanna be popping up so that they know that they, that I'm accessible, that I'm findable, that I, I'm here. Um, and then they can search if it's like a good fit from there.

But I wanna at least be an option on the menu. Oh yeah.

Um, yeah. And so what I've seen is that, and this is where I think like the trifecta truly is having a website with blog posts, uh, YouTube and Pinterest.

Because when I search for those things, not only does my Google Business Profile pop up, but so do several of my videos and several of my pins in addition to the different website pages and blog posts. And so people depending on their way of learning and retaining and absorbing information, they have multiple options.

They have visual, they have, they can read it, they can, um, watch it. And, um, I totally forgot because like, it feels like such an, an afterthought.

But I have actually also, um. Like, use my, the audio from the YouTube videos, um, and literally just uploaded them as podcast episodes.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Um, again, it's like, not like the prettiest or smoothest. Like I, I don't even like see an intro.

It's just there

Jules White: doesn't matter. I think it, yeah, if people, and because the great thing about audio is people can listen when they're out walking the dog or when they're, you know, like, yeah.

On for, for your, um, for your kind of clients, for on their way to school or something like that. They can be listening, whereas maybe they don't wanna be sit sitting watching a video.

So you can be just there in their ears when they're getting about going about their daily lives, I think, really. So, yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, exactly.

Jules White: That's really important.

Um, yeah, I think, I think certainly the, the search engine part of it, and I guess that's part of the power of Pinterest as well, is the searchability of it. And certainly when I Googled you earlier, it was your website was top then your YouTube and then your Google business profile was on the side.

And then I saw some of the other stuff. So there was certainly a, a real presence online of the, like, different places that you exist, which is really important for AI search as well, I think.

Really. So, definitely.

So if you were starting your business again and, and trying to, if, take yourself back to, well, I dunno, I suppose it, it is hard because the world has changed so much, but would you do YouTube again if you had your time again? Would you, would you go for YouTube?

Would Mallory Do YouTube Again?

Mallory Grimste: Oh yeah, absolutely.

Hands down. I tell everybody that like, um, 'cause I think a lot of people like you get like those dopamine hits of like, oh wow.

Another video, another video from like TikTok. And now, um.

Instagram reels and Facebook has their own reels, like, like the short, quick like satisfaction. And because they push it out to so many people, the vanity metrics, man, they get you on these because it's, you have a seven-second video, so it's easy for people to watch and rewatch and rewatch versus like a seven-minute video.

I mean, that takes a little more attention and care and everything. Um, and so with that, um, I tell people if you're gonna be making videos anyway, even if they're short videos on these other platforms, like they're gonna push it out immediately, but they're not gonna, like, there's no way to like search it up again.

Like I can't tell you how many times I'm like, oh, I wanna like pull up that video. What, where was it? What could I find it?

But if it's on YouTube, it's gonna show up and if you in your description have it, you can have it automated where it automatically populates. Um, like your general description, you can like personalise it from there.

So you never have to forget to link back to your website. I have a little disclaimer that like, while I am a licensed mental health therapist, this does not mean that I am your therapy.

This is not therapy, you know? Yeah. The little legalese.

Jules White: Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: Um, but that's another hit for people being able to search you up and find you.

Yeah.

Jules White: Yeah, definitely. Yeah.

And, and SEO on there as well for YouTube, it's got massive SEO opportunities. So with the, all of those words within your transcript on, on YouTube are definitely searchable.

And I think that's, um, definitely something when you were talking about turning those videos into blogs, it's your own. And I do that with mine as well, and I definitely have done that where I've just put the, just put the podcast episode on my website as, as called, called it a kind of a blog cast and just put the transcript on there.

I'm trying to, I'm, I'm definitely trying to be more intentional about my own content now as well. So trying to just, especially at the moment, focus on cornerstone pieces of content.

So the ones that are the most important or the most relevant, and really turning those into proper blogs. But because it is my own words and with your videos, it's your own words, it's your own unique lived experience, that is the, how those articles will then stand out versus just AI-generated content that it, you know, we are all fighting against now with blogs.

Definitely. That actually it needs, it, it needs to be content that either has existed pre AI or content that has your, your own experience and everything in there.

And I, that's why I love turning, turning that kind of content videos, audios into blogs. It makes it so much better, I think in terms of the quality really.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, definitely. And I think you really helped me with this mindset too, because I was stuck in the, like, I have to feed the algorithm, um, like, uh, Trina Little who I worked with to learn about YouTube and everything she calls it. Um, do you remember like Mario with like, you have to like get the gold coins.

She's like, YouTube, you have to like get the gold coins to keep it going. And like one of the gold coins is like consistent videos.

But at a certain point I was like, okay, am I doing this because of like an algorithm or am I doing this for some other purpose? And it was clearly a different purpose.

Yeah. And so now even with like, like I have so much old helpful content out there that's still usable and applicable, like that hasn't changed.

Um, if I'm gonna be focusing on something, like for this year, I've only committed to repurposing four blogs over the whole year. And so right now, and like, I'm not even, like, I'm not even on schedule with what I

Jules White: I'm doing four blogs this year and I've done zero.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, I've done one, I have done one, but, um, I'm in the middle of like the second one. And, um, I was supposed to do like one per quarter that was like the ideal.

Um, but like life has been busy, like personally, professionally, and like at the end of the day, if I post according to my arbitrary schedule, is that really gonna make a difference? Mm-hmm.

Probably not. Uh, but I do tell people, like, if you're worried, like for, for those of us that, um, like our clients like get better, they move on.

Like they've, they no longer need our services, which is the point. That's what we want.

Um, you know, there is that initial like, who's gonna be on my couch next? Right.

And so during those moments, I've really kind of transformed my own thinking of that, where like, okay, if I'm noticing that like, like my calendar is looking a little emptier than usual or I know like cyclically over the summertime because I do work with school-age kids, um, like this is when they're going to summer camps, this is when they're doing like the college tours, things like that. And I want them to do that.

Um, I don't wanna be like the holding, like you have to come in, uh, if there's not a safety concern. Um, so I just use what would've been client time as like my marketing time.

So if, um, you know, I might not be as absorbed in it as if I had like a two-hour, three-hour block. But if I have an hour block, like I'm gonna be trying to do something to kinda keep the wheel turning.

Jules White: Yeah. Yeah.

Definitely. Yeah.

AI & Mental Health

Jules White: Have you, um, thought about releasing anything around AI, mental health around AI? Because that must be a, that's like a, a big change, I guess since you last released a long-form video, have you thought about doing anything around that?

Mallory Grimste: I have that, I think that like, it's so like, evolving, if that makes sense.

And I don't feel comfortable with my knowledge and skillset with AI to use it in coordination with clinical work or like assisting that because I just, I'm just not convinced that the safeguards are there and like the fact that they don't have like a healthcare version yet. Like,

Jules White: that's what I mean.

I mean, I mean more, more for your, for clients and for, for the, the, um, effects of it for your audience. I mean, rather than actually using it to help you using it for the mental health implications for teens and children using AI themselves.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

I think it's still honestly like truly so evolving and like, we don't have, like, I have my theory of course, but like we don't have like the data to support it yet in either direction. And like for all I know, like, and I do think that this probably is the inevitable way that things are gonna be going, I do think that it is going to touch every aspect of our care, including mental health care.

And I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing, but I do think that we need to be informed. Um, like I know like when, um, telehealth was first coming on the scene as an option, a lot of people were like, you can't do therapy on a video.

You, they have to be in person.

And I was a little old-school at first. I was like, I don't think I could ever, and then I had a winter where I, I'm in Connecticut and so it gets snowy here.

Um, we had a really bad winter one year where it was like almost every Tuesday and Wednesday. It was like such bad snowstorms that like nobody was going in anywhere, like roads were shut down.

It was just a mess. And that was probably like a good five or six weeks in a row.

And so I just wasn't seeing my kids that would regularly be coming in those days if they weren't able to reschedule. And I only had so many hours that I could give.

Um, and a lot of them really struggled. And so that was like my moment of like, well, I have to kind of get over myself, figure this out.

And thankfully I did. And so we were using it as a backup for like if there was like a health or traffic or like snow or something like that.

Um, so by the time that the pandemic hit, my clients and I were already familiar with this, not to this level, but I,

Jules White: I was gonna say was that that pre-pandemic, and I bet you were glad that you'd already explored that because Oh no, that's fine. We had

Mallory Grimste: our system set up.

Jules White: We don't need to stop every anything.

It's fine. It's fine.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

Jules White: So, um, when you stopped producing videos for YouTube, where did that attention and that time that you were spending on that, where did, did you, did that immediately switch to something else?

Or was it kind of just a, like, time gets gobbled up in our business? Right.

Mallory Grimste: I think a lot of it was like the gobble up stuff.

Um, that was also, I'm trying to remember. Um.

I think that's when I was first really trying to, um, launch. It was called the Coping Skills Crash Course originally, but now I've renamed it Your Calm Code.

So I have, um, at the, at the moment, I have two digital programmes that are, um, like consumer-facing. They're not necessarily for therapists for, for, for people who are looking for additional support, either in addition to their therapy or like, they're not able to access therapy for whatever reason.

So it's not, it's not therapy. It's more like the psychoeducation supports that we talk about, like the stuff in my videos, honestly.

And one of them is called Your Calm Code, which is all about like, okay, when you're having an intense emotional experience, like what do you do to like move through that to get through that? And that's coping skills.

And you really need coping skills if you wanna do the deeper work with therapy because, um, feeling should be popping up if you can't feel your feelings, like you're just gonna be torturing yourself. And we don't want that.

Jules White: No, no, definitely.

Yeah. Yeah.

I think it's, I think it's amazing. I wish I'd had something like you, somebody like you when I was a teenager, because I think it would've just made so, so much of a difference really.

It really would've done so. Yeah, definitely.

Mallory Grimste: Oh, well you have it even better now because like, obviously I'm not your therapist, but we're friends.

Yeah,

Jules White: absolutely. Absolutely.

So what do you think, um, in terms of YouTube, like myths and mistakes, what do you think are the biggest mistakes that you see people making with YouTube?

YouTube Mistakes to Avoid

Mallory Grimste: Oh, I think trying to copy somebody else's video as your own or trying to like trend hop. Um, I was given some, um, I don't necessarily think it was bad advice, but I don't think it was applicable advice to me about, um, during like the Olympics when, um, oh, who was it?

It was Simone Biles and, um, the tennis player, I can't think of her name right now, but both of them had come out and it was like a, a big like news article flow about how they were prioritising their mental health over, like their sports obligations and commitments and how the two really kind of interact.

And like, it was important.

And like, as a therapist, I'm like, yay, mental health, taking care of yourself, you know. Um, but the person who I was consulting with at the time for like, you know, strategy and everything on that was like, you need to make a video on this because this is what people are searching for.

But it was so like, I don't know anything about like gymnastics or anything. And so it felt.

Like inauthentic as I was making it. And like, it was one of my worst performing videos by all metrics, the vanity and the ones that matter her, because it just wasn't my thing.

Yeah. Um, and I was like, okay, I'm not gonna like, try and be like, oh, this is like the hot news story of the day.

You know? Um, I'm gonna be focusing more on, you know, what are the situations that I see pop up like with my clients that could be applicable outside without obviously using my client's experience.

So like, I would never be like, um, so came in on Wednesday and she was really struggling with, um, like school anxiety and this is what we did. Like I would never, ever do that.

No. But if I'm finding like, you know, client after client is coming in with similar things and I'm sharing similar strategies, I'm, I'm gonna share like, you know, if, if like, this experience feels like applicable, like if you're struggling with being able to like, show up to school and like feel comfortable there, um, these are some strategies that you might wanna try, um, without like disclosing anything about my clients.

Jules White: Yeah, definitely, definitely.

I think, I think churning out content, there is a, there is a bit of, of a thing of churning out content and hopping on trends is one of the, one of the ones, I was at a training workshop a couple of weeks ago and it was all about YouTube and that was definitely some, one of the things that they were teaching was, oh, you need to go to Google Trends and find out what's um, trending and create an AI video about that. And I was just like, no, that's not me.

That's not me. Yeah.

Mallory Grimste: I think if that's, I mean, that is a business approach for sure.

And like, if that's the business that you wanna be running and that's like applicable, like absolutely go for it. Um, it's not for me.

Jules White: No, me neither.

Mallory Grimste: At least as of today, I, you know, I, I do leave room open that I may change my mind in the future, but I don't, I don't see that happening.

Jules White: Definitely. I think the authenticity and being yourself and focusing on what you know as well, rather than trying to be everything to everybody, I think is, is always gonna be a winning formula really, to be honest with you.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

And I will say also like, don't get caught up in like, how you sound, how you look, things like that. Like people do need to see all sorts of bodies, all sorts of representations.

And so the fact that like you are showing up as long as you are yourself, like that's the biggest thing. Yeah.

Like, I remember asking, I'm like, oh, like should I like pay and get my makeup done before I hop on video? And they were like, no,

Jules White: definitely not. Otherwise you're gonna do one video and that's it.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah,

Jules White: definitely.

Oh, I, I, I had, I went through that definitely with the podcast where I started to worry about am I delivering enough value and is this actionable enough and is it, am I giving too much? Like am I giving people too many things to do?

And all started massively overthinking it and started then trying to write myself more notes than I normally would. And you can definitely see it.

And I, I listen to those episodes and I'm just think, oh no. Whereas actually the ones where I'm just a little bit rambly and you know, just me talking about what I know, I find that, yeah, they, I listen back to them and I think, no, that definitely is a better episode than one where I've tried to make, to fit it into some kind of script or structure or something like that really.

Definitely.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

And I will say, um, I know you didn't ask about this, but can I kind of jump into like the metrics that like actually matter on YouTube?

Jules White: Mm-hmm. Please

Mallory Grimste: do.

Key YouTube Metrics That Matter

Mallory Grimste: Um, like, besides obviously like the main metric that I am always looking for is, um. Are the clients that are finding, or the people who are calling to become clients of mine aligned, like the, is it a match?

Um, and are they like, becoming clients? Like that's the ultimate thing, right?

Um, is it like helping that sort of thing. But in terms of like on YouTube, if you are trying to like, reach a certain goal, like a certain subscriber or like view count or something like that to like unlock some feature, um, the main metrics to really pay attention to are not like, they're not even comments or anything.

Or, I mean, subscribers do unlock aspects, so like, maybe that's something, but in order to get those, it's really average watch time. You want to shoot for people watching at least 50% of your video.

Jules White: Mm-hmm.

Mallory Grimste: And you wanna like, the more, the better. 'cause that means that they are actually in like, literally engage with their video.

Like they, like what they're hearing or seeing like they're following along. Um, and also it's called your CTR person.

It's like. Click, oh gosh, I, I don't even remember what it's called, but it's like your click-through rate, um, which is basically when they see your title and your thumbnail, are they clicking on that to watch the video?

Mm-hmm. Um, so you, you want that, I believe like a, a good percentage to shoot for is, um, like three to 5%.

But that's like, I mean, that's like a seller top end kind of a click-through. But if like you're getting like 0.5%, like just seeing, okay, what can you do to get it to 0.6% to 1%?

Like any movement forward, that's, those are those gold coins that that woman Trina talks about, that YouTube wants to see. Um, so you can, and what's cool now, they didn't have this in the beginning, um, when I started, but now you can actually go into your individual videos and see where people are kind of like dropping off so you can see, okay, what was it like right before then?

Like what are the theories? And for me, I found, you know, everybody in the beginning with editing and stuff, you've gotta have like short, quick clips, yada, yada.

People watching my videos did not want that. They just wanted a video straight through talking like, don't, don't cut it up so much.

Don't like flashy or anything. Which I was like, oh man, do you know how much time and energy that would've saved me?

Yeah, Jules White: absolutely. If I'd have known that.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

Jules White: And then the algorithms change or trends change and then it's like, oh, okay, right now we'll try something different.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah. Yeah.

Jules White: So it has been amazing talking to you.

Um, so if people want to find out more about what you do and um, how they can have a look at your videos and learn more from you, where do they need to contact you?

Where to Find Mallory

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, so, uh, my handle on everything, including the YouTube channel is at Mallory Grimste.

Um, so it's just my name spelled out. Uh, my website is mallorygrimste.com.

Um, pretty much everything is there, so if you wanna see like where I am or what I'm doing or anything, that's a great lake hub. Um,

Jules White: love that.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, would love to see you on the YouTube channel and like, if you're obviously coming from this podcast or Jules' world, um, leave me a comment and be like, Hey, I heard you with Jules.

Jules White: Absolutely, yeah, tag me in that as well.

I'll, I'll link to your channel in the show notes on this and link to my channel as well. So yeah, come and come and have a look.

Check out Mallory's stuff. And it's been fantastic and I, I hope this is, um, just some inspiration on different ways that we can grow our business without social media really.

And I think it's definitely something to consider. So it's not something to go into lightly.

I think it's, especially with YouTube, it's something that, it does take time to produce videos and it's, but it, the great thing is if you are doing that, it can con continue to deliver for you for years to come, really. So I think that's important.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah, absolutely.

And you can literally just reshare the same video.

Jules White: Yeah.

And I guess when, once you've got people that are actually watching your videos that are four years old, even just you going in as, as you say, you can't keep up with the comments, even just doing that is helpful. 'cause it tells people that you're still active and that your business is still there, I suppose really, isn't it?

So,

Mallory Grimste: yeah.

Yeah.

Jules White: Fantastic.

Oh, it's been so lovely to have you here, Mallory. Thank you so much.

Mallory Grimste: Yeah.

Jules White: And thanks for listening and I'll see you soon.

Bye.